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Post by Nate on Sept 27, 2015 2:28:30 GMT -5
I decided that like Rob is doing on his EOS podcasts, I'm going to rank the seasons and winners as I go along my 30 season rewatch followed by the corresponding podcast. Just finished AO podcast so here's my rankings of the first two seasons. Y'ALL SHOULD DO IT TOO
1. Borneo While it may have been one of the least conventionally exciting seasons ever, it was still the first season, and with the cast as amazing as it was, it made up for the lack of strategy and actual playing of the game. I think what sets it apart from Australian Outback is that it's the OG season and Richard, Sue, Rudy and Kelly are the most amazing Final Four in the history of Survivor. 2. Australian Outback This season had a great pre-merge, but the post-merge was very boring. While this season also benefitted from a very strong cast, I think Borneo's cast was stronger overall. It also seemed to actually digress rather than progress in the amount of game playing there was, taking out the advantage this cast had of knowing how the game works, while in Borneo they were literally thrown into unknown territory and had to figure it out for themselves.
1. Richard Hatch To have the winner of the very first season, where nobody knew anything about the game before playing, be such a witty and manipulative person is amazing. Hatch had a firm grip on the game, but of course he also had many flaws on top of this. However, compared to Tina, they both had the social game, but Richard had the strategy to overpower her game. 2. Tina Wesson Tina's social game is one of the best in Survivor history easily, however, beyond that, Tina really didn't do any strategic work to get to the end. Not to mention, Colby had much more control over how the game was going to go than Tina did. Tina played a solid game for the time she was playing, but not strong enough to be high up on the list.
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Post by Jhonmarco on Sept 27, 2015 13:34:44 GMT -5
Tina played an incredible game, the problem is its all coveted up and hidden since no one wanted to be as openly strategic as Hatch since he was hated at the time. Tina was a lot like Maggie from BB6 in how she brainwashed people into never turning or flipping and making any moves against her because she was a good person and the good people needed to win the game. Moves like booting Jerri at 8 and letting Elisabeth and Roger make 5 are examples of how she kept this appearance up with people. Also she had some other good moves like finding out from Kimmi that Jeff had votes cast against him at a challenge and this being used against him at the merge. Also not shown (it happened on the way to tc apparently), Tina flipped the game on its head and got Colby to boot Mitchell with her and Keith. To say Colby had more control isn't really accurate to me seeing as how Tina manipulated the game that she was never gonna be targeted and even more so, people really liked Tina with moves already mentioned above.
In general, Australia has a lot of good to solid players but it's all hard to see because the people didn't wanna be openly strategic and had to do it in a stealth manner so they weren't vilified by America. I'd put Tina ahead of Richard for sure.
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Post by Jhonmarco on Sept 27, 2015 13:41:25 GMT -5
But yeah I'm trying to do a rewatch with all the seasons too, I'm only like halfway through tho.
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Post by Nate on Sept 27, 2015 14:11:00 GMT -5
Tina played an incredible game, the problem is its all coveted up and hidden since no one wanted to be as openly strategic as Hatch since he was hated at the time. Tina was a lot like Maggie from BB6 in how she brainwashed people into never turning or flipping and making any moves against her because she was a good person and the good people needed to win the game. Moves like booting Jerri at 8 and letting Elisabeth and Roger make 5 are examples of how she kept this appearance up with people. Also she had some other good moves like finding out from Kimmi that Jeff had votes cast against him at a challenge and this being used against him at the merge. Also not shown (it happened on the way to tc apparently), Tina flipped the game on its head and got Colby to boot Mitchell with her and Keith. To say Colby had more control isn't really accurate to me seeing as how Tina manipulated the game that she was never gonna be targeted and even more so, people really liked Tina with moves already mentioned above. In general, Australia has a lot of good to solid players but it's all hard to see because the people didn't wanna be openly strategic and had to do it in a stealth manner so they weren't vilified by America. I'd put Tina ahead of Richard for sure. Eh I think you're giving Tina too much credit. She may have thought these things, but we have no proof of this because she almost never talked about her strategy or why she did things. I'd like to believe she was masterminding all these things that you're talking about, but I'm more inclined to believe that she wasn't thinking this in depth about things considering she almost never led us to believe that she was thinking strategically. Colby, however, was almost always the "swing vote" and had everyone wanting him on their side. If he had handled the jury better at the FTC, he definitely would have won.
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Post by Jhonmarco on Sept 27, 2015 14:19:34 GMT -5
Tina played an incredible game, the problem is its all coveted up and hidden since no one wanted to be as openly strategic as Hatch since he was hated at the time. Tina was a lot like Maggie from BB6 in how she brainwashed people into never turning or flipping and making any moves against her because she was a good person and the good people needed to win the game. Moves like booting Jerri at 8 and letting Elisabeth and Roger make 5 are examples of how she kept this appearance up with people. Also she had some other good moves like finding out from Kimmi that Jeff had votes cast against him at a challenge and this being used against him at the merge. Also not shown (it happened on the way to tc apparently), Tina flipped the game on its head and got Colby to boot Mitchell with her and Keith. To say Colby had more control isn't really accurate to me seeing as how Tina manipulated the game that she was never gonna be targeted and even more so, people really liked Tina with moves already mentioned above. In general, Australia has a lot of good to solid players but it's all hard to see because the people didn't wanna be openly strategic and had to do it in a stealth manner so they weren't vilified by America. I'd put Tina ahead of Richard for sure. Eh I think you're giving Tina too much credit. She may have thought these things, but we have no proof of this because she almost never talked about her strategy or why she did things. I'd like to believe she was masterminding all these things that you're talking about, but I'm more inclined to believe that she wasn't thinking this in depth about things considering she almost never led us to believe that she was thinking strategically. Colby, however, was almost always the "swing vote" and had everyone wanting him on their side. If he had handled the jury better at the FTC, he definitely would have won. I mean why would Tina be so open about it in confessionals when she's not trying to be openly strategic? I know this has been mentioned in interviews and even in Mario Lanza's book and on the survivor podcast: historians. That all makes me believe all of that was true that Tina was playing a great game and just had to hide it. Even then, I think Tina should be cut slack in this regard since it was a different time and you couldn't be openly strategic and even then, she still did play one of the best games. That's true, but Colby was never gonna swing since Tina completely brainwashed about the good people winning and how she completely manipulated Colby as a mom figure, knowing Colby had a great relationship with his mom. Colby was a great player too, but theoughout the game mismanaged people like Keith and Jerri. A lot of the jurors even said they felt Tina was the reason her tribe came out on top and a great strategic hand in their success.
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Post by Nate on Sept 27, 2015 14:43:42 GMT -5
Eh I think you're giving Tina too much credit. She may have thought these things, but we have no proof of this because she almost never talked about her strategy or why she did things. I'd like to believe she was masterminding all these things that you're talking about, but I'm more inclined to believe that she wasn't thinking this in depth about things considering she almost never led us to believe that she was thinking strategically. Colby, however, was almost always the "swing vote" and had everyone wanting him on their side. If he had handled the jury better at the FTC, he definitely would have won. I mean why would Tina be so open about it in confessionals when she's not trying to be openly strategic? I know this has been mentioned in interviews and even in Mario Lanza's book and on the survivor podcast: historians. That all makes me believe all of that was true that Tina was playing a great game and just had to hide it. Even then, I think Tina should be cut slack in this regard since it was a different time and you couldn't be openly strategic and even then, she still did play one of the best games. That's true, but Colby was never gonna swing since Tina completely brainwashed about the good people winning and how she completely manipulated Colby as a mom figure, knowing Colby had a great relationship with his mom. Colby was a great player too, but theoughout the game mismanaged people like Keith and Jerri. A lot of the jurors even said they felt Tina was the reason her tribe came out on top and a great strategic hand in their success. Regardless what is true and what isn't, I still feel like Tina was a very social heavy player, while Richard had a great balance of strategy and social. His social game wasn't as strong as Tina's for sure, but he had the mindset of a player that could still be considered a fantastic winner in season 30 and he didn't have anything to base his game off of.
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Post by Coke on Sept 27, 2015 14:48:14 GMT -5
I think Colby in the Outback was a better player than Tina tbh.
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Post by Jhonmarco on Sept 27, 2015 14:59:48 GMT -5
I think Colby in the Outback was a better player than Tina tbh. Why?
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Post by Coke on Sept 27, 2015 15:03:34 GMT -5
I think Colby in the Outback was a better player than Tina tbh. Why? Nate already alluded to it. But I feel like Colby was just as social/liked as Tina and he was kinda making all the strategic decisions at that point.
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Post by Jhonmarco on Sept 27, 2015 15:11:28 GMT -5
Nate already alluded to it. But I feel like Colby was just as social/liked as Tina and he was kinda making all the strategic decisions at that point. I don't think Colby was as liked since Tina didn't have people on the jury that disliked her like Colby did and Tina was credited by the jury as making the decisions.
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Post by Brooke on May 3, 2016 21:33:15 GMT -5
I'm gonna catch up with Nate!! Just started this season. One of my favorite seasons!
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Post by Nate on May 3, 2016 22:10:41 GMT -5
I'm gonna catch up with Nate!! Just started this season. One of my favorite seasons! I don't think it will take you long. I'm a slow a**. Hopefully I'll move faster when I'm finished with school. You should do rankings with me too!
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Post by Brooke on May 9, 2016 23:32:59 GMT -5
This season was so good!!!
Really glad they do away with the tiebreaker being "Who has the most past votes" BS.
Guarantee had they had the rocks they would have gone to it twice. Once with Mitchell and twice with Jeff V. Crazy they got voted off by past votes. CRAZY I SAY!
I think it's difficult to say between Tina and Colby who played the better game because both played completely differently. Colby's speech however pretty much gave Tina the win. He started off by saying, "I'm not going to tell you I played a better game than Tina, because I didn't...." Colby Grade A idiot.
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Post by PG on Jul 7, 2016 16:05:19 GMT -5
Review
Just finished this season, and I liked it a lot more than the last time I rewatched it. I still don't think it's on par with future seasons just because the game slowly gets more strategic, but compared to Borneo it was a lot more interesting to watch.
I feel like this season we see a lot of survival take place... with the evacuation of Skupin, the flood that took their camp, and the risk of the forest fire... not to mention seeing crocodiles in the water that they swim in (which felt really realistic for me having been in Australia and constantly being told not to go in the water due to these things). Surprised they were actually swimming in water that they see crocodiles in... craziness.
Fun fact, I actually got very close to the area they filmed this season in while I was doing my traveling. But I didn't realize it until afterwards and at that point I couldn't actually go to find it. Would have been cool to visit the camp and stuff where they filmed the season. Oh well, was still cool.
Awards
Player of the Season: Colby (Simply because I feel his strategic game was better than Tina's) Hero of the Season: Elisabeth Villain of the Season: Jerri
Rankings
16. Keith - Still didn't like him at all. Seemed like he was a jerk to pretty much everyone, and didn't look like he enjoyed being there at all. Also the fact that both Tina and Colby said right after he got voted out that he didn't deserve to make it that far bothers me.
15. Nick - Extremely boring. I always forget this guy even exists when I think back to this season.
14. Mitchell - Also boring. Could have been strategic come the merge. I think he showed some signs of being smart... but I don't know, I don't remember much.
13. Kel - Oh the beef jerky incident. That was fun to watch. Other than that he was just trying to provide for the tribe but couldn't fit in. Don't think much of him.
12. Debb - She was alright for a first boot, but usually first boots have something a little memorable about them. She's pretty forgettable.
11. Maralyn - She was a sweetheart that had a mean extreior. Her relationship with Tina was cute, and it was just nice to see her insight on situations like the beef jerky and that sort of stuff. She was definitely a good premerge boot.
10. Amber - To think this girl got brough back after her performance this season. Literally the only thing I rember about her is she was Jerri's sidekick. Other than that, yawn.
9. Jeff - I try not to let future seasons bias me, but I think in Jeff's case I can't really help it. You can kind of see his Cambodia personality come through more now, and although he wasn't as full out as he will be in the future season, he is still a decent character. Definitely way more boring than Cambodia though.
8. Kimmi - I'm always on the fence with this girl. I can never decide if she annoys me or if I'm rooting for her. It's kind of inspring to see a vegetarian come onto Survivor, but when you start kind of making it a problem to other people it does get a bit annoying. I understand where she's coming from though, so I kind of like her. Plus the fight with Alicia was iconic.
7. Skupin - Once again I didn't like him up until his boot episode. He just seemed like he was trying way too hard to be the leader of the tribe, and I'm one who never really likes those types of people. But he's sort of a legend for being the first medical evacuation, and you can't help but feel bad for him for getting evacuated when all he was trying to do was help the tribe.
6. Rodger - He's the nice old guy this season, and although he didn't really do a whole lot, he was just a good pressense to have around. His relationship with Elisabeth was really nice to see also. First father daughter dynamics.
5. Colby - I liked him a little more on the rewatch because I sort of realized he was the one who was making the strategic moves this season. Last time I think I just saw past that and only saw him as a challenge beast. But this time I actually saw he had personality and was actually a decent character. Still don't think he's as good as people say he is, but he was better this rewatch.
4. Tina - She was just a nice, sweet lady who played a really good social game. At times it seemed like she was just hiding behind Colby a bit, but I have to remind myself that the editing this season was very different than what we see now. I think she probably was just as apart of the strategic moves and Colby was. But it was just a good change to see someone get through mostly based on niceness and relationships.
3. Alicia - She had an attitude, and it was an entertaining type of attitude. She was a physical threat and that's the main reason she was taken out. She seemed to always have an opinion on everything and that made her fun to watch. "I will always wag my finger in your face"
2. Elisabeth - In a way I still feel like they took Colleen and just got rid of all the snakiness and left us with just this super nice, happy girl. But the thing I like so much about Elisabeth is that we saw real emotion from her. She cried a lot and it seemed like she truly connected with the people around her and just the whole experience in general.
1. Jerri - I stand by my statement before, Jerri this season is not as villainous as people make her out to be. YES, OKAY, she was probably the biggest villain on the season, and yes, at the time we hadn't seen anyone like her, but compared to people we have now and days, Jerri could easily have been a hero. She's still one of the most entertaining things on this season due to the dynamics she had with everybody (Rivals with Keith, Relationship/Rivals with Colby, Friendship with Amber, One Sided Rivals with Tina). She definitely seems to be the one who had a lot of interpersonal relationships whether they be good or bad ones.
Who Should Come Back
1. Elisabeth - The only person from this season that I would like to see come back, and we know it's probably never going to happen. I'm interested to see how she would play with the new strategies of the game, and if she would be as nice as we saw this time around. I also think it'd be nice to see a sweetheart come back, because now and days we don't have any characters that are purely sweethearts.
Winner Rankings
1. Richard Hatch - He's iconic because he's the first winner, and to be fair he played a really, really good game considering it was the first season. He's strategic, and he was all around a really interesting character. He pissed people off, and somehow still found himself winning the game.
2. Tina Wesson - It's kind of nice to see the exact opposite from the first seasons winner. Richard was a strategic player, whereas Tina perfected the social aspect of the game. Sadly she wasn't as interesting, and honestly she wouldn't be as memorable as Richard.
Season Ranking
1. Australian Outback - I'm a little surprised by this, considering last round of rewatches I did, I definitely liked Borneo better. But this time, Borneo just felt really unbearable, and I actually got a little bit of enjoyment out of this season. Also a lot more memorable events happened in this season, and the survival element felt a lot more real. The strategic game I felt also really picked up this time around.
2. Borneo - Yeah, the cast was stronger in this season... but the editing, and the lack of strategy made it extremely difficult to watch. It had it's moments, but I feel like if I were to rank this one higher it would simply be due to it being the iconic first season. But yeah, I would much rather watch Australia than this one. The editing style also brings it down a bit.
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Post by Jhonmarco on Jul 7, 2016 17:40:21 GMT -5
I'm always surprised when people praise Elisabeth so much. She's cool, but there's nothing too interesting or complex there. If you swap her out with a Jefra, nothing significant would change imo. Not a bad character at all, but I feel like she's talked up a lot as a character. I'd say Neleh does her character type a lot better.
I agree with most of those rankings besides Elisabeth and Alicia being that high. I always thought Alicia was always so sour and unpleasant.
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Post by Dankan on Jul 18, 2016 13:40:59 GMT -5
This season improved upon the basis that Survivor: Borneo had in some ways, but also promoted laziness because they already had the game figured out. One thing that made this season stand out was the presence of a real survival aspect. There were several instances where starvation almost took place, Michael's hands being burned and a flood destroyed the majority of their camp, which definitely made the game more real. The starvation incidents were mainly due to poor rationing, which were both caused by Keith's stupidity and need to validate himself. The flood; however, was something genuinely out of their control which forced the survivors to rebuild camp and work together to survive despite the fact that they were competing. Michael's hands being burned also threw a random element into the game by evening the tribe numbers before the merge.
The second thing that was a change from the first season was the fact that the Final 2 were viewed a lot better by the jury. The first season saw two people which were referred to by Sue as "a snake and a rat" and were generally disliked by the jury, but with the second season, many of the jurors had a difficult decision between Tina and Colby. While Tina ended up winning the game, Colby won four immunities in a row, had a great social game and worked WITH Tina to get to the Final 2. Many people will claim that Tina organized these moves on her own, but they talked about it being a joint effort to make it to the end. They both played an excellent game, but if Colby hadn't gone into the final tribal council with the mindset that he was going to lose, he would have won the game.
The thing that probably irritated me the most about this season is the fact that Ogakor still felt the need to vote along tribal lines long after the merge had happened. I understand that the Final 3 deal between Tina, Colby and Keith had been made pre-merge but Elizabeth would have been a much better option to take to the Final 3 because she was trustworthy and ultimately played a better game than Keith. Hopefully this will change once the tribe swap comes into play but the fact that the gameplay is still restricted to tribal lines post merge makes the game a lot less interesting. This ties into the laziness that I mentioned early because there were several opportunities to change the game but Ogakor conformed with the strategy of the Tagi tribe from Borneo by essentially executing members of the opposite tribe until the Final 3 or 4.
This season was definitely more interesting than the previous one due to the random events of the game, but the strategy involved was lackluster and less documented compared to Borneo.
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Post by Joey on Sept 14, 2016 14:37:57 GMT -5
Ew?
"In 2001, Debb, a widow since 1997, was engaged to her stepson, Robert "Bob" Eaton, 11 years her junior."
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Post by James on Jul 16, 2017 17:03:46 GMT -5
This season is BORING AF lmao
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